Check out the new Home for Counter Steer Drifting...

For those of you looking for more Counter Steer Drifing info. Check out Team Arai's new super forum. "CSjunkies.com" It's just starting out, so help us fill out the info.

Check it out....

www.CSjunkies.com

HPI TC-D

And here is another look at the HPI TC-D...looks promising too.



(nice find Ulyz)

This gear sounds pretty good to me. From my test, I seem to like 1.65 range. So sounds prefect.

CS Session 3 Test and My Results...

This past Sat, I had a long session getting to tryout various front to rear gear ratios on both my CS Cyclone and Driftmaster CS.

First I compared the grip I had on the Cyclone with the a 40/15 vs 32/23 set up. To get it to work right for me I had to modify the engine mounts so I could run a crazy 80/15 Spur and Pinion. This worked out to a 1.87 to 1 ratio. This made full lock countersteer drifting, but the rear end was just didn't have enough traction for my style of driving. After trying a few other ratios, I ended back at more conservative 1.668 to 1 (40/15 vs 32/20 with a 80/17)Which works pretty good, but still just not enough traction in quick transitions. But I think with some more suspension tuning, this might be the way to go for me.

Next I set my attention to my Driftmaster shaft-drive. With this I started off with the same 1.49 to 1 ratio. (42/15 vs 39/18). The car had much improved grip over the belt car, and was super fun to drive. The counter steer still wasn't that great. But then I got hooked up with a new 44T (which made it 1.56 to 1), this along with some more rear toe, and stiffer rear spring, made a pretty good improvement on countersteer. But still maintained all the traction I wanted. It was now super fun to drive. Again, I don't think this setup is ideal, because it could still use some more under or over drive. But for now it's still pretty fun. Below is a quick video Katsumi made of my car running at Arai.

From my test, and my driving style I am guess a good front to rear gear ratio is about 1.6 to 1.7... but I think depending on your driving style it could be way different.

I think with a little more practice this set-up is still capable of constant countersteer. I just need to get use to using a little less throttle. After we filmed, it got the hang of it a little better...

Very nice Countersteer Drifting...

I was just about ready to give my conclusions of what I think works at Arai, but then I just watched my friend's Jhon's crazy countersteer video on youtube. It looks sick! I don't understand how his setup with a front ball diff, 1:99 to 1 ratio and crazy final gearing work (according to my math it's 5.33 in the rear?), but it definitely works for him. I noticed, at Arai we had some different ideas, but in the end I guess it really does depend on your driving style. I'll have to think about this stuff some more.

Anyways, check out his new video. good stuff and even more amazing to me with his setup...Great driving Jhon!

Fine line between Countersteer and no traction...

While now I am still looking forward to testing out the cars Sunday. (too bad I might miss the Lakers though....Hopefully they win tonight, and I can record the Sunday game and track it with the old iphone app)

Anyways I just reduced the gearing on the Cyclone form the (1.81 to 1.70) and I am liking the extra traction in the back. Below is fellow Arai member Ulyz' Cyclone at Arai, this past weekend. (running a 1.67 ratio) Looks good. Can't wait to try mine. Seems like there is a really fine balance you need to find in the overdrive ratio to chassis setup... Hope I can find it soon.....

Here's Katsumi's video of Ulyz... enjoy

The same but different... Belt Drive vs. Shaft Drive

Well this isn't really a comparison, but I did want to post up where I am at with my Belt drive CS Cyclone and my Shaft drive Driftmaster CS. After doing more work on both steering systems, the cars have pretty much the same steering angle. (pretty cool since I haven't seen another LCG with that kind of steering before)

Both cars are getting close, but just are not quite there yet. I know I have been trying a lot of things, and one week I post one thing, then come to find out next week the opposite is better. It's tough working on new ideas, but so far:

The CS Cyclone (1.81)has good countersteer, but lacks rear grip for transistions. This makes it hard to control sometimes. But the steering angle looks great. (current setup 39/15 33/23 but planning on going 39/16, 33-2/23 soon)

The Driftmaster CS (1.21) has good rear traction, but lacks a lot of counter steer. But it is still really fun to drive and it actually looks more realistic with less countersteer. (current setup 42/13, 39/18 but looking for a 44)

Both are good in there own ways, and both really fun to drive, but still both I think can still be better.




























This Sunday I plan an going to Arai Driftland again for some more testing. I have a few things I want to try. It will also be good get some input from the other guys.

(One really cool thing about a CS setup, is since you use a lot of camber and a wide track isn't necessary for speed, you can slam the body down low. I love it!)

Do you see what I see?

After watching all these JDM Counter-Dori Videos, I really wonder how they get so much angle and control with their set up. So I decided to do a little research on the #1 CS chassis. The Alex Racing CER D08. I know it is kind of difficult to get one here in the USA, but I thought it might be helpful to see what they were working with. After some close inspection of these pictures, I see some key points that I have mentioned in recent post. So I think at least a few of my mods to my Cyclone are on the right track. Check it out and see if you see what I see.

If you spot something please post a comment on this post.
p.s. Is it me, or does this chassis look alot like the new Cyclone Drift Chassis coming out...intersting!

A new JDM Countersteer videos to subscribe to...

If your like me, you've been trying to hunt down more countersteer videos to try to learn more about how to set them up. Everyone knows about the great D-Like videos, but here is another guy I found in Japan. This time they are indoor.



This video even has a Cyclone in it. (Yellow JZX)
Check it out!

CS Test at Arai #2

Well this weekend the CS Cyclone definitely handed much better. Counter steer and angle was good, but still the car transitions much faster then Katsumi's CS BD. Definitely did notice some good tips though. One was the rear toe. Strangely enough, this seems to have the opposite effect it does on a normal AWD drift car. By lessing the toe from 3 to 2 degrees, it actually added stability in my CS car. Very interesting.

Another item that I mentioned before, is non-Ackerman steering. Seems like this is pretty much the opposite as well. If you are thinking "that stuff is confusing!" I think that too! LOL.
But after playing with my CS car and normal AWD car, I think I am starting to get a better understanding.
( I found this online at RC TeK, I read this before, but after testing my cars with paralle and with ackerman, I think I am starting to understand it.) Give it a read if you have time...


At Arai this weekend, I also decided to give my Driftmaster LE a CS twist as well. Now that I have most of the parts, I will see if I can make it interchangeable. i.e. extra set diffs and gears to trade out if I want to try CS or regular AWD drifting. (I already figured out a way to get parallel steering in my LCG. (I'll have that later on the blog.)

So now there will be two simultaneous CS builds. Project CS Cyclone (Belt) and Project CS Driftmaster (SD).... updates soon!

Chop, chop, a new battery tie down...

After trying a few more things to balance out the corner balance, I decided to replace the stock plastic battery tie-down for something with a little more weight. I looked around for some material and came up with this old piece from a AEM fuel rail. Since it was nice and smooth, I thought it might make a good replacement.

So after a little chopping and grinding, this is what I got...

Finally an improvement

After trying out a bunch of suspension tricks. I decided to counter weigh my car. From past experience with my well tuned Yokomo Driftmaster, I decided to see where I was at on my Cyclone. To my surprise it was really unbalanced. I never really noticed it too much with a normal drift set-up but since I am still learning the driving technquice on countersteering, the imbalanced really seems to mess up the predictablity of the car in transition. The main reason seems to be, I am now using Lipos in my Cyclone (before I only used the Lipos in my Yok, and Ni in my HPI) . To help counteract the weight, I increased the number of 10g weights I had behind my battery. I ussually just used one, but now I think I have like 7...LOL!


But after testing it out today, I think this really made an improvement. The car is much more predictable and I have a lot more confidance swinging the car back and forth. Rear traction is improved and the counter-steer is definately still there too. I think I am on the right track again... ( I even moved my electronics around to help out on the balance)



Today I could easily do nice Countersteer figure 8s. (not at max counter yet though...)

Back to the tuning.

After watching more D-Like videos, I am determined to start tuning my Cyclone. At the last test, it seemed like the rear didn't have enough grip. So after trying a few suspension set-up tricks, I decided to try a slight gear ratio change. I am now trying a 23/33 (instead of the 32). I also changed the 64P to a more durable and slightly higher 80/17T gearing set up.

Well see how that goes.
I have also been playing around with the front steering some more. Seems like if I put the end ball links on top instead of the bottom, the Ackerman effect is less. So, I'll also give this a try too...
But, I did notice with the arms on top (instead of the bottom) there is more toe out when the front squats...

Shakedown at Arai.

This past Sat, I finally got to shake down the new setup at Arai. And it is pretty close, but now it seems like I need to gain a little more rear grip back. The counter is there, but the rear is just a little to loose.

One interesting thing I did learn this weekend, is the importance of front toe. I noticed very big differences in control just by playing with the front toe. So I feel this is a very important area to consider when setting up your C/S car.

It was also a good time for some "Let Me Try" which is basically the Team Arai style of trying other team members cars to compare the differences. This I think is a big plus for our team. Set-up of the car is everything and I think this helps us out big time.

From this video you can see Rob's (FC) car is getting close to Katsumi's (Supra) setup! Awesome. Mine still needs some work, but I think I can get it there soon too.....

Little clean up.

To clean things up and to make the 23T R40 pulley look a little more like it belongs in the Cyclone, fellow Team Arai member Ulyz came up with a really good idea to shave the pulley down. Plus it helps clear one of the lower button head screws under the pulley from hitting the larger pulley.

Now it looks alot better too. Better then before (see here)

the better doughnut...

Just a quick video of some doughnuts. As you can see the counter-steering is better now...



I really want to try a real track now!!!

Steering update.

Now that the car has much better counter steering, I figured it would be a good ideat to play around with the steering mounting positions on the the outer arms. I noticed I could get even more steering using the more inner mounting positions.
Not sure how this will effect steering response or feel yet, but full lock definitely increased.


*One other note, it is important to set up the front toe so, it makes both the inside and outside wheels straight when countering. (So basically it is a toe in set-up. How much really depends on your steering )

Red 32 preview...

Finally got to mate up my new Red32 body and my Counter Steer project. Here is what it looks like.

I still need to install some custom buckets and lights.

Red Hot 32

Stickers on the R32. Finally get some use of all those ORC Z decals...LOL. Looks pretty crazy with the paint in the sunlight.

Now I am looking forward to seeing some drifting tomorrow. Lots of new cars.

p.s. Fuck V8 Nascar engines in imports! (it's so Gay!) I say they should ban V8 and V10s in drifting!!!

Yoks & Demon Camber...more counter!

After getting the initial install of the 23T pulley in, the feel with Kawada tires was definitely better. The car could countersteer, but there wasn't a lot of steering angle used to keep the rear out. So I decided to try Yokomo Zero1 single ring tires. This helped a little too, but once I started adding more front camber, thats when the real progress was made.

What do you know, 23T, Yok tires and losts of Caster and Camber really work...
Now, I really need to just get the car on a real track like Arai to fine tune the suspension.


Hope you can see my Yellow-Gold wheels. (the Tamiya can said: Chrome Gold, but guess not...LOL) It should still look pretty good with my new R32 body coming...

Late night install...

Well, after a late night install, I have finally gotten my R40 23T pulley installed in Project CS Cyclone. Getting it to fit definitely took a little ingenuity and some searching for extra parts, but in the end it seems to work good. The pulley is not only larger by the number of teeth, but the mounting points as well. It has a larger shaft opening and uses a larger pin. You also don't need to use the one endplate, since it is so wide it goes up against the bulkhead stiffener plate. What I didn't notice at first is one of the lower button head bolts interfere with the very corner of the pulley, but I just ground it a little and now it's good. Now we just need to see how it preforms...

I also decided to replace the 108 spur gear & RS4 15T with a new set. (the old ones were pretty beat)